Daiwa Freams 2011 - Schematics & discussion

fisho
edited June 2011 in General Fishing
Hi All,

i was excited about the new Freams 2011, it was interesting to see the big D putting in so much into their entry R4 model. Features i like:
- Zaion material construction, making the reel light
- Drag Specs
- Air rotor, reduced weight, looks great! (i would like Daiwa to come up with a new Branzino utilizing the air rotor.. non magseal or silly-con seal pls, unless its easy to self service)

Like some inputs:
1 Can someone kindly post the schematics of the new Freams or the link to 1?

2 Spool - is there a white color bush below the stack of UTD drag washers? (tot i see 1, not the bushing on the shaft)

3 Frame - The silver chrome Engine Plate, do you think its functional or just cosmetics? The Certate, Saltiga engine plates have screws holding the engine plates, supporting? the bearing to the body, the freams?

4 Silent Oscilation - built in?

5 Price point? Good or look elsewhere for a better reel at its price?

your thoughts about the 2011 MiC Freams appreciated.

TIA
  • khseah
    hmm.. saw a few kakis selling their new freams but no comments about it here??
  • Fishless
    With Mag Seal, servicing will eventually become a problem.
  • knht
    Fishless" said:
    With Mag Seal, servicing will eventually become a problem.
    light weight yes, solid drag yes, but i will mainly use this reel for fresh water luring or onshore salt light luring, becoz of the shallow spool n line capacity. I can only fit in around 100m of 20lbs braid line. with that capacity, u can forget about using it for offshore bottom.
  • fisho
    [Knht]...I can only fit in around 100m of 20lbs braid line. with that capacity, u can forget about using it for offshore bottom.

    which reel size r u refering to? From the Daiwa site, the reels capacity seem similar to Daiwa's other models. Could it be that u didn't pack the line in tightly?

    can u kindly post the reel schematics? i still cant find it online :(


    [Fishless]...With Mag Seal, servicing will eventually become a problem.

    It doesn't seem like a magseal, more like a piece of felt impregnated with some kind of oil, silicone stuff..

    - Freams 2011-
    http://www.globeride.jp/daiwa/fishingsh ... reams.html

    cheers!
    -Mak
  • knht
    fisho" said:
    which reel size r u refering to? From the Daiwa site, the reels capacity seem similar to Daiwa's other models. Could it be that u didn't pack the line in tightly?
    I typed wrong, should read as I have problem packing in 100m of 30lbs Spiderwire Code Red line to the new Freams Size 2500.

    It was discussed before and also based on the line capacity specs that the new Freams has smaller line capacity than the old Freams Kix. For eg, new Freams 2500 is rated to pack in Pe2 line of 150m while the old freams kix 2500 can pack in pe2 line of 200m.
  • john.lee
    Fishless" said:
    With Mag Seal, servicing will eventually become a problem.
    I tot the freams is oiled seal n not mag sealed?
    Correct me if I am wrong
  • khseah
    Freams 2011


  • khseah
    Freams Features

    Real Four - Real Engine, Real Control, Real Endurance, Real Custom – the jewel of Daiwa Technology is the future direction from Daiwa in the design of spinning reels.

    Digigear II - Digital gear design ensures a perfect mesh between ultra-tough, surface treated alloy drive gear and marine bronze pinion gear for optimized speed, power and durabilty.

    Oil Seal - Oil Shield not only prevents water intrusion it also provides smoother revolution to the rotor system and increases sensitivity. Anglers will feel more connected to lures, detect more bites and fight fish with ease. Real design and real technological development for ‘reel sensitivity’.

    Silent Oscillation - By combining Digigear drive with dampening washes, Real Four design reels are virtually noise free.

    Zaion body - Daiwa’s latest exclusive high density carbon resin body material. Lighter and stronger than alloys and 100% corrosion resistant.

    Engine plate - Set on both sides of the main body, the Engine plates apply direct pressure to bearings and gears to enable perfect meshing of the gears.

    ABS II - Daiwa’s unique reverse taper results in less line tangle and longer castability also. The oversized design provides higher winding speed and better drag performance.

    Neo Cross Wrap - Daiwa’s unique Crosswrap line laying system, cross wraps the line on the spool avoiding line dig in, increases line pick up and further increases casting distance.

    Twistbuster II - Twist Buster is Daiwa’s original advanced technology designed to reduce line twist. Powered by the new CRBB (Corrosion Resistant Ball Bearing), the Twist Buster II line roller not only minimises line twist, but also reduces further friction between the line and the roller.

    Airbail - Daiwa’s innovative bail design featuring a hollow tubular stainless steel bail for maximum rigidity and strength with minimum weight. Due to the smooth, protrusion-free design of the Air Bail, even loose line common after a cast slides easily down the bail onto the line roller as the reel is rned, without snagging or hanging up.

    Ultimate Tournament Drag - Daiwa’s exclusive new ultimate drag system combines ultra smooth low inertia with ultimate fish stopping power.

    Washable - Intensive studies of saltwater influence have resulted in the development of a washable construction for saltwater use. A water \‘duct\’ at the bottom of reel allows effective water discharge and simplifies maintenance by allowing the reel to be washed after use, without concern for drainage.

    Real Stopper -

    Linear Shaft -

    Capsule Body -

    Air rotor -
  • fisho
    Hi Knht,... noted abt. the line cap. ..thks!

    Hi Khseah, THANKS! for the schematics..!!
    - The new capsule body housing the felt washers look simple enuf for self service :)
    - more assured is that the main shaft bearing (50) can be reached for maintenance.

    Q? where are the 4/1 bearings stated in the spec?.. i see bearings numbers..50, 68, 74.. can't see other 2 bearings.. in the handle??

    potential ball bearings change.. the 2 white plastic bushes, 7 & 10. & the line roller bushings..33 & 35

    cheers!
  • Fishhead
    Let me start by saying that I have always been a Shimano fan. And I have always keep quiet and tahan when my Daiwa fanclub friends tell me that "shimano sux la, not very durable, always spoil, corrode like siao, daiwa better more durable more solid etc".

    Anyway, about 1mth+ ago, I heard abt the new freams and I decided its a good chance to buy a Daiwa reel to try, since I was looking for a light weight reel, so I bought the 2000 and 2500 to try try.

    Here's my review:

    For the 2000 size:


    Weight:
    - It is very light, not as light as the luvias or stradic/rarenium ci4 but its light enough for the price.

    Casting:
    - Good, no problems, no noticeable difference from my shimano reels

    Smoothness:
    - Quite smooth, I would rate it at about as smooth as my Ultegra.

    Drag performance:
    - Drag is smooth and stable, I use it for light stuff so I don't crank it up much, so far so good.

    Reel construction:
    - The reel looks awesome 10/10.
    - Knob is a very nice I-shaped rubber knob, very comfortable 10/10
    - But the frame is not very solid, the rotor bends under load 5/10.

    Overall:
    - Decent for pan sized fish. 6/10

    For the size 2500:

    Simple. It is a horrible reel.

    - The knob is horrible compared to the nice rubber knob on the 2000
    - The drag is terrible compared to the 2000, I can hit 6lbs on the 2000 no problem, this 2500 cannot even hit 6lbs, I set drag to 6.5lbs, fish run, rotor collapse onto the spool.
    - The reel body itself is not very stable, it wobbles under load.
    - Now the reel cannot use properly, rotor problem.


    Conclusion:

    The new Freams is a far cry from the Freams Kix.

    So I finally gave Daiwa a try(as per friends strong suggestions) and what did I get? A so-so 2000 reel and a broken 2500 reel.

    All I can say is, I'm very disappointed. Wasted my $375 on those 2 reels, could have use it to buy the new Biomaster 2011... I cbf even repairing the reel, god knows one day I hit the fish of a lifetime and it breaks again, not gonna risk it.
  • fisho
    Fishhead" said:


    Conclusion

    The new Freams is a far cry from the Freams Kix.

    So I finally gave Daiwa a try(as per friends strong suggestions) and what did I get? A so-so 2000 reel and a broken 2500 reel.

    All I can say is, I'm very disappointed. Wasted my $375 on those 2 reels, could have use it to buy the new Biomaster 2011... I cbf even repairing the reel, god knows one day I hit the fish of a lifetime and it breaks again, not gonna risk it.
    Hi Fishhead,

    Thx! for your inputs at 4am!!.. :D

    Personally, i do use both Shimano & Daiwa reels..

    For Daiwa spinning reels, i've have/had the Caldia 4K, Freams Kix 4K, 3K & previously a Certate 3.5K HD custom..

    The Caldia 4K is serving me very well for Rompin bashing. i actually bought a smaller Freams Kix 3K & sold it new, in anticipation of the Freams 2011..when the new Freams arrived, i couldn't commit to buy it after a few looks at the shop, hence requested for some feedbacks here.

    Sorry to hear your unplesant experience rgds to the new Freams. The consolation is that the Freams Kix, Caldia are great value for $ reels. You dun hv to write off the Daiwas.. ;)
    (OT - psst... i'm eye balling the Biomaster SW, supposed to be fitted with CF gear. :badgrin: )

    keep this rolling..

    tightlines!
  • Cheermin
    I know of a fren who jus threw it away, after the shaft broke. Cant even b bothered to send for repair though is only less than a week old.

    MIC....go figure....good things dun come cheap.....but again cheap things nt really no good...jus yr luck i guess....

    For a couple of hundred bucks, I prefer to invest abit more than to bet my luck nor the fish of my lifetime
  • Fishhead
    Cheermin" said:
    I know of a fren who jus threw it away, after the shaft broke. Cant even b bothered to send for repair though is only less than a week old.

    MIC....go figure....good things dun come cheap.....but again cheap things nt really no good...jus yr luck i guess....

    For a couple of hundred bucks, I prefer to invest abit more than to bet my luck nor the fish of my lifetime
    Yea i know what u mean man, but u know sometimes a deal seems too good to resist haha, lightweight reel for under 200, plus its a daiwa, not some crappy brand also. Thought it would be fine haha.

    But tbh, ever since i started looking into daiwa reels, i've been hearing quite alot of horror stories from other fishos. Before that, everyone sing praises, but once i do more digging, i hear abt all sorts of problems like shaft bend/break, rotor collapse/break, reet foot snap etc. Most of these problems i never hear of before after using shimano for so many years. And the worst part is most of these stories i hear are not of low end models, i hear caldia certate luvias feugo those level of models. I swear im not exagerating when i saw each of those models, i have heard of at least 2 instances of something break, and almost every model at least 1 fisho told me rotor collapse.

    To make things worse, last time i went to bungsamran, my fren wanted to buy a reel, i told him the 2 top models are saltiga and stella sw, he saw the saltiga and fell in love with it. The min he brought to the counter, 1 of the guides and another staff told him not to buy, get stella swa instead, 40% discount, cheaper and better. Guess what is the reason they gave? Saltiga prone to rotor collapse, coincidence? If a saltiga rotor can collapse, i honestly believe that daiwa's air rotor technology is flawed. Talk abt investing more money, the new saltiga costs abt 1.2k, and from what i've heard, now im scared to even bet my fish of a lifetime on daiwa's flagship reel.

    Talking abt cheap lightweight reels, the pfeuger patriarch spinning reel, now this is what a lightweight reel is supposed to be like. I picked one up for $165 from bungsamran shop, its on 40% discount, and so far im thoroughly impressed by it. Abt the same price as the freams but in a completely different category of quality. It completely owns the stradic and rarenium ci4s that i had last time.
  • fishynatic
    wah, i bought the new 2500 fream. first 5 fish caught was 2kg temensis, it gave a smooth drag, 2nd fish caught was a hefty 9kg toman n i was playing heavy drag due to playing live bait, when i was satisfied that the toman had mouthed my catfish then i close bail arm n set hook strongly, reel still ok, 3rd fish was a 1.3kg chermin at kelong n was playing tight drag, reel was still ok. 4th trip was at pasir ris main pond, catching mjs, ack, kbl all around 2kg. 5th trip, was spin flying again, caught nothing; was just fishing at jetty n i heard an undesirable sound like drrrrrttt when i was reeling in the spin. nope it wasnt the 14lb fireline i was using.. send it to tackle2000 to check2 ( i bought it there. ) they say the rotor or shaft something2. but there was no major defects. should bought the kix back then. LOL!
  • knht
    wow, eye opening. Hearing so much horror stories of the new Freams, i think i will hold back the purchase of the new Daiwa T3 reel which is also made of Zaion material. Will wait till extensive users field review of the new T3 before buying.

    But whatever said, one would not expect to plunge a $200 worth of money for a 2000/2500 size reel and get that kind of lousy quality. One may argue the cheap price but still, $200 is not small money and certainly doesn't expect daiwa to produce this kind of crap reels.

    Perhaps daiwa should do a product recall, LOL
  • john.lee
    Personally I have felt the reel at some tackle shops but have not purchased this reel yet
    Not because of the reviews that was input here,
    Reason being that I have no confidence in the oil sealed technology,it just felt like daiwa is trying to come out with a cheap version of the mag sealed certate.
    Not to mention the finish feels too plasticky like the stradic ci4 which is a far cry from the fuego's zaion body.

    I have always been a hardcore daiwa spinning reel fan owning almost every reel from the mid range to the steez (putting the low ends aside),but I still feel that something was wrong with the reel,just like how come the ci4 technology is still not used on the stellas yet.

    *no offense to shimano spinning reel fans cos my main reason why I dun like shimano spinning reels are the thin bail arm for the size 2000up,but for the 1500 n 1000 sizes,I like the shimano as well.

    However if you are gonna write off the zaion material used on the body,than I would say you are jumping a bit too quick to conclusion on the materials used,
    I got two td fuego which is the other reel which uses the zaion body.
    And so far I got no problems with the problems that any of you encountered so far(maybe I m lucky)

    But I still feel that it would probably be a good choice to email daiwa and tell them of the problems of the reel and let them Improve on it,in fact not only for daiwa but for any other brand as well,cos if we do not feedback,how is anybody ever gonna be able to produce better reels?
  • Cheermin
    With the new current line-up of daiwa models, I get kinda disappointed with them. With their highest end models manufactured elsewhere other than Japan, i feel they had sort of let down their loyal fans. But notwithstanding some good low to mid range reels that give a run of $$$ as compared to the high end ones like saltigas, the previous Revos, Oceanos and Phantoms really impressed me. But they are not enough to prevent me from switching camps. Shimano, I'm coming for you....

    Just my 2 sens
  • appleling
    IMO, Jap reel manufacturers price their reels according to quality and features. The higher the price, the better the quality and has added features. Daiwa and Shimano both produce good reels but then nowadays there are too many models coming from China and they are very cheap mainstream models. So both companies cannot just survive on making specific use models...eg. Stella n Saltiga for popping and jigging. So in order to save cost and produce cheaper mainstream models for the general market. Daiwa makes their medium cost reels in Korea and Thailand, Shimano makes their medium cost reels in Malaysia. Both of them makes their lower end reels in China. In order to compete for the mass market in fishing reels. Ryobi, ABU, Penn, Tiburon, Shakespeare, DAM and many more have gone to China for their mass market reels not to mention fishing rods. However, going to China means you have many imitation or similar looking reels coming out with different brand names...a bit of difference here n there but the mould is roughly the same...actually spoils the established brand. Which is why Penn also still produce their top of range reels in the US.
    It really depends on us buyers to choose the quality vs price...If you are really serious and spend a lot of time fishing, i suggest you get a pricier but better reel knowing if you "don't abuse" your quality reel, it will not breakdown on you during fishing time and will last you longer than inferior ones.
  • Insouciant
    I read about what this guy had to say about the 'zaion' material and it doesn't leave me confident about it. http://www.stripersonline.com/forum/thread/768370/daiwa-saltiga-2010-the-review Read it and consider it before purchasing your next 'zaion' reel.
  • fisho
    Hi kakis,

    this thread's discussion is great!

    ref to Alan Hawk's review of the Stella, a comparison to his Saltiga review..

    http://www.stripersonline.com/forum/thr ... the-review
    =====

    i usually joke with friends regarding to ladies having "headaches" shopping for shoes, given the variety available...
    i tell them that they've probably not met anglers.. just look at the variety of tackle we can choose from.. choosing lures alone is a "headache" ;)

    =====

    Daiwa - is the exciting brand of reels to me since mid-2010 till now, the new Saltiga, Certate, Freams, T3...

    - air rotor - is the show stealer for me. Engineering geometrical design for good strength, low mass & great looks on the reel.
    - Mag seal - interesting method over a mechanical seal, to reduce frictional loss at the main shaft/body. However, being non-user servicable, (status quo?) is a minus point to me.
    - Zaion - low density, good strength, corrosion resistant,.. what's not to like?

    Outcome of the above used on the products cited... I wanted to purchase a newer Daiwa model, however, neither the lighter, great looking Saltiga, the mag-sealed Certate nor the new Freams has sold me over the previous Hyper Certate, Freams Kix & Caldia Kix models.

    ....anyone knows which shop still carries the Freams Kix 3K ? Else, i may have to trade back the pc i sold to my buddy.. LOL

    tightlines!
  • Hookz
    Omg.. jus got the freams 2500 for my nephew.... this reel sucks big time man. the spool wobbles alot and is super noisy when retrieving line. not to mention the bail arm nearly touches the spool when oni set on half the recommended drag pressure ( ard 3kgs ). this is one daiwa reel tat disappoint me big time. except from the new look... its worth nothing of the $190 i spent on it...
  • rockit
    edited February 15

    fisho said:
    Hi All,

    i was excited about the new Freams 2011, it was interesting to see the big D putting in so much into their entry R4 model. Features i like:
    - Zaion material construction, making the reel light
    - Drag Specs
    - Air rotor, reduced weight, looks great! (i would like Daiwa to come up with a new Branzino utilizing the air rotor.. non magseal or silly-con seal pls, unless its easy to self service)

    Like some inputs:
    1 Can someone kindly post the schematics of the new Freams or the link to 1?

    2 Spool - is there a white color bush below the stack of UTD drag washers? (tot i see 1, not the bushing on the shaft)

    3 Frame - The silver chrome Engine Plate, do you think its functional or just cosmetics? The Certate, Saltiga engine plates have screws holding the engine plates, supporting? the bearing to the body, the freams?

    4 Silent Oscilation - built in?

    5 Price point? Good or look elsewhere for a better reel at its price?

    your thoughts about the 2011 MiC Freams appreciated.

    TIA

    Yuo can find 11 Freams schematics here: http://reels.spin-review.ru/cgi-bin/reel.pl?config=daiwa.pl&sort_d=y&ser=Freams&template=7&matches=7&page=3

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